New Yamaha Tourer... - Page 7 - GL1800Riders
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post #61 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 02:24 PM
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They are just trying to build bikes that will sell. They look at the U.S. and see Harley selling almost all the V twin bikes they can make, so they copy them and think they will sell so they build V twins with liquid cooling, overhead cams, 4 valves per cylinder and Harley still sells all their bikes. The Honda VT1800 was a rocket ship for a V twin, but it didn't have a single crank pin engine and some people didn't think it sounded right, and it didn't sell well,so no more 1800 V twin from Honda.

Boring the retro cruiser may be but their are an awful lot of them on the road.


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Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice. Shame on me.

It may very well be a different company this time, but we have all seen this movie before. I can still taste the disappointment from the Kawasaki Voyager fiasco, and all the worthless hype leading up to that disaster. I am not falling for that one again. The Japanese motorcycle manufacturers are stuck on making copies of Harleys, and I have seen nothing that even hints that it will change any time soon.

This is why the US motorcycle industry is dead. The Japanese have lost their creativity when it comes to touring bikes, and they are not investing in the US market. As a result, potential buyers are yawning at the whole mess and staying away.

I still hold out hope, but I am expecting the worst. Odds are, this new bike will probably be just another boring retro cruiser with saddlebags and a trunk.

I got myself depressed just typing that.

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post #62 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 03:17 PM
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They are just trying to build bikes that will sell. They look at the U.S. and see Harley selling almost all the V twin bikes they can make, so they copy them and think they will sell so they build V twins with liquid cooling, overhead cams, 4 valves per cylinder and Harley still sells all their bikes. The Honda VT1800 was a rocket ship for a V twin, but it didn't have a single crank pin engine and some people didn't think it sounded right, and it didn't sell well,so no more 1800 V twin from Honda.

Boring the retro cruiser may be but their are an awful lot of them on the road.
If Harley were selling all their V-Twins, you wouldn't find left over 16's at discounted prices at dealerships.
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post #63 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
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They are just trying to build bikes that will sell. They look at the U.S. and see Harley selling almost all the V twin bikes they can make, so they copy them and think they will sell so they build V twins with liquid cooling, overhead cams, 4 valves per cylinder and Harley still sells all their bikes. The Honda VT1800 was a rocket ship for a V twin, but it didn't have a single crank pin engine and some people didn't think it sounded right, and it didn't sell well,so no more 1800 V twin from Honda.

Boring the retro cruiser may be but their are an awful lot of them on the road.
I understand that, but the status quo isn't working. The Japanese have been trying for 30 years to break into the cruiser market, and they aren't exactly setting the market on fire. You could put two wheels and a Harley badge on a grocery cart and the Harley faithful will buy it over a Japanese bike. When are the Japanese going to get it through their heads that the retro cruiser market belongs to Harley. That would be like Toyota or Honda trying to compete against the Mustang or Camaro or Challenger. Those are American icons that are off limits.

The Japanese market in the US has showed now signs of recovering from the recession. Harley did for a few years, but even their sales were down in 2016, despite still being down over 30% from their peak 9 years ago.

As I said, I hope they finally got off their butts and designed a real modern touring motorcycle. But.....

Last edited by Sparky57; 05-17-2017 at 05:39 PM.
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post #64 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 09:18 PM
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The Japanese have been trying for 30 years to break into the cruiser market, and they aren't exactly setting the market on fire. When are the Japanese going to get it through their heads that the retro cruiser market belongs to Harley.
Exactly, and if you look at the Japanese motorcycles with the longest and most successful track records you find bikes like the Goldwing, Royal Star Venture/TourDeluxe, FJR, ST1300 and so on. None of them were based on any kind of v-twin HD copy.

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post #65 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-17-2017, 09:56 PM
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Since 1977 I've owned nothing but Honda Motorcycles. Until 2005 when I bought a 400cc Yamaha Majesty Scooter. Loved it! Put 27.000 trouble free miles on it. Sold it for a 650 Suzuki Burgman Trike conversion.

IMHO Honda has been asleep at the wheel for years. Relying on their name & reliability. Mean time the fit & finish & reliability of the others have caught up with them with some instances surpassing them.
Its time they got back in the game with some exciting products & a experienced marketing team to put them again a head of the others.

Bring on the new Yamaha!

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Last edited by silverbullet05; 05-17-2017 at 09:58 PM.
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post #66 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 08:56 AM
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You are right , all motorcycle sales have been going down, but for a lot of years Harley sold everything they could make(and sometimes at a premium) and the Japanese copied them. All brands are hurting now

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If Harley were selling all their V-Twins, you wouldn't find left over 16's at discounted prices at dealerships.

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post #67 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 09:00 AM
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I agree I wish they would build something better, but I'm sure they have done any number of studies and find that V twins are the big seller in North America. I can just picture when management went to the engineers and said we want you to build a 1500 cc V twin, single crankpin, single carb and only needs to put out 60 horsepower or so, some even specified pushrods and air cooled

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Originally Posted by Sparky57 View Post
I understand that, but the status quo isn't working. The Japanese have been trying for 30 years to break into the cruiser market, and they aren't exactly setting the market on fire. You could put two wheels and a Harley badge on a grocery cart and the Harley faithful will buy it over a Japanese bike. When are the Japanese going to get it through their heads that the retro cruiser market belongs to Harley. That would be like Toyota or Honda trying to compete against the Mustang or Camaro or Challenger. Those are American icons that are off limits.

The Japanese market in the US has showed now signs of recovering from the recession. Harley did for a few years, but even their sales were down in 2016, despite still being down over 30% from their peak 9 years ago.

As I said, I hope they finally got off their butts and designed a real modern touring motorcycle. But.....

Bill52
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2004 Flare Red Gl1800A Goldwing
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post #68 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 02:12 PM
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I know that there are a lot of V-twin fans out there. And yes, they have that "image" thing working for them. But, there will never be a large V-twin two-up touring bike that will work for me or compete with a Gold Wing.

With the weight of the V-twin engine up high in the frame, plus the weight of the gas up higher than that in the frame, I am just too small (and getting too old) to manage that much high-up weight in parking lot maneuvers, steep side hill stops, etc.

If it weren't for the Gold Wing's flat six engine and gas tank under the seat design features, I would not be able to handle it for two-up, luggage-full riding, which is 95% of my riding.

I sat on a Victory Vision at a dealer one time and I couldn't even get the bike up off the side stand! Not kidding. Just too top heavy for a 140# skinny guy like me!

The Gold Wing will never be replaced as king of the two-up, long-distance touring bikes for me.

***
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post #69 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 02:16 PM
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Wingman I will agree with you that the wing is just plain nice and many other bikes are a bit of a exercise to handle at times.
While 4 out of 5 of my bikes are trikes I still find the flat six valkyrie and wing to be my long distance ride of choice. This with the added bonus of going off the paved roads without worry of breakdown.

"Take the right turn"
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post #70 of 384 (permalink) Old 05-19-2017, 09:16 PM
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With The new Yamaha being introduced at Americade June 5th, I might have to make the 15 minute ride to Lake George to see it !
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